The F&B Playbook Hotels Still Get Wrong

What separates a great hotel restaurant from one that quietly loses money?

In this episode of Check-In with Bryan, Bryan sits down with hospitality veteran Guy Reinbold—former VP of Food & Beverage and Corporate Executive Chef at Marriott International—to break down what actually drives success in hotel F&B.

With over 40 years of experience, Guy shares real-world insights from the front lines of hotel operations, covering everything from concept development and menu strategy to guest expectations and profitability. From fixing underperforming restaurants to navigating brand standards vs. owner ROI, this conversation is packed with practical takeaways for hotel owners, operators, and hospitality professionals.

They dive into:

• Why most hotel restaurant concepts fail before they even open
• The balance between brand standards and owner profitability
• How guest expectations should shape your F&B strategy
• The real impact of pricing, room service, and retail on revenue
• Why simplicity and execution matter more than over-designed menus
• Lessons from decades inside one of the world’s largest hotel brands

Whether you’re building a new concept or trying to fix an existing one, this episode is a masterclass in keeping hospitality both profitable and authentic.

👉 Don’t forget to subscribe for weekly insights from leaders shaping the hospitality industry.

#Hospitality #HotelManagement #FoodAndBeverage #HotelBusiness #Leadership

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:57

This episode of Check In with Brian is brought to you by Reliance Hospitality. Hospitality consulting, project management, and business process outsourcing built exclusively for the owner's side of the table. PIPS, renovations, budgets, brand compliance. We manage it all so you don't have to. Learn more at reliancehospitality.com. Welcome back, everyone, to this week's episode of Check In with Brian. I'm your host, Brian Fish. And this week we're going to talk about food and beverage, which everybody loves food and beverage. They love to have food. They love to have a beverage. But sometimes it's a pain in the ass at the hotel. And especially if you're a hotel operator or an owner, it doesn't always work the way that you want it to work. You're not making the money you want to work or you're not making the money you want it to make. And well, fuck, you're just gonna have to dead at that again. But I'm gonna keep going. We'll put it together. But at the end of the day, it's great when you have a brand partner that understands that it's not their money, and you actually have to do something that the guests enjoy and that you'll have success with. And I've got that guy for us today. Guy Reinbold, I met gosh, back it's been probably at least six or seven years ago, it was pre-COVID. But he's an amazing person. He was a legendary figure when I was at a hotel that was a Starwood brand. The merger had occurred with Marriott, and all I heard was about Guy. Everywhere I went, it was, oh, you gotta hear, you gotta talk to this guy, Guy. He can help you with all your food and beverage issues. And he was just this legendary figure that one day I did I reached out to somebody and said, Hey, I need help at this specific hotel. And they were like, And I said, Can I get a hold of a guy? And I got connected with Guy and I fell in love with this man from the first phone call. Uh Culinary Institute of America trained and 40 years with Marriott International. Now he's started his own agency. He's web consulting with clients just like we do, but uh from a food and beverage perspective, and he's excellent. So this is gonna be one that you will love, especially. And I know that Guy's got a ton of fans out there, so be sure to uh give him some love as well. So we'll be right back as I sit down and check in with Guy Reinbold. Welcome back everyone to this week's episode of Checkin' with Brian. I'm your host, Brian Fish. And today I have someone that if you've been around, you've probably either heard of the guy because when I was uh managing hotels, I uh was uh hearing of this legend person uh during the Starwood Marriott merger that there was this man that worked in food and beverage called Guy that would be amazing to talk to. And it took a couple of years before I met him, but I did meet him. Um but if you haven't heard of him, you've at least met him. So I feel like there's probably nobody in a third bucket out there. Um his name is Guy Reinbold. He had over 40 years of experience leading hotel food and beverage operations with Marriott International as VP of food and beverage and corporate executive chef. He attended the Culinary Institute of America back in 1974. I think the 70s were a great period. I can only imagine the fun you had at CIA back in 1974. Um, but this man's the real deal. He understands it not just from the franchise perspective, but he also understands it from the uh brand managed perspective as well as he's the guy that you want in the room because he's also looking out for the owner and the investors at the same time. He he understands that just because it's pretty doesn't mean it's gonna make money. And uh I love this guy. Every time there's a food and beverage situation, I give his number out. Hopefully, people are calling him. And I've been wanting him on the podcast for a while, and we finally were able to make it happen. Guy Reinbold, welcome to the check-in and thank you so much for taking time to sit down with me today. This is amazing.

SPEAKER_01 4:56

Thanks for the opportunity. Thanks for the nice uh introduction. I don't know if I don't know if I can Well, you really are. It's so funny.

SPEAKER_00 5:02

You really are like, I think, especially with the in the Marriott world, you were like a this legendary figure because I'll remember I was at a comp the first conference that Marriott did with after the Starwood merger. I was saying like we were having issues with food and beverage in certain per areas, and they're like, Oh, there's this man named Guy Reinbold. And like I remember the first few people knew who you were, but they didn't exactly know how to get a hold of you or like what your actual role was, but they had heard from somebody else that you were like the the man that could like create, like fix whatever the problem was.

SPEAKER_01 5:35

Well, that's a good thing you do in a corporate office. You can let don't let people know exactly what you're doing, where you're at.

SPEAKER_00 5:39

So and I remember we got connected because we had a full service shared in that I was just like I want to say, rolling back in my head, I believe I had an executive chef at the time, or uh right before that, that had put a hot dog on the menu. And that was like I had just had it, and like nobody would listen to me. I was like, the guests don't like the food, and I cannot believe you just brought me a hot dog with ground beef on top of it. At a and I'm thinking this is a shared and why did you bring me this hot dog? And I ended up reaching reaching out to Richard Vayu and saying, like, can you get a hold of this guy person that everyone talks about? Like, are we able to because I don't think I didn't understand that you actually had moved into the franchise world. You were working with the franchise operators, and you came out to Phoenix and spent a couple days with us. And I felt good because you had validated a lot of things I had said, which was like, we need to go like be doing what people are expecting to come here for to eat. Like, we should have chips installed. So, like, let's get some tequila, let's do all these things. We implemented a lot of them, but I did get some pushback from some other individuals. Unfortunately, I wasn't the CEO of the company at the time. So today I would just be like, this is what we're doing, guys. Um, but uh yeah, it it changed the dynamic, but it it told me, Brian, you're not an idiot. You understand, like the consumer is right at the end of the day, like whatever's gonna sell is gonna sell. But um, no, I think you you your your uh what is it they say? Your uh your reputation precedes you, sir.

SPEAKER_01 7:14

That's kind of the you know that that as as we've spoken and we spoke then. I mean, guess go somewhere to try something, right? And it's our job to use it.

SPEAKER_00 7:23

You don't go to Switzerland and not go seek out chocolate, right? I'm assuming like, yeah. I think the only thing you as a traveler when you go out there, and it's funny, it's a trend, I feel like, is you go check out the local McDonald's. But again, why do you go check out the local McDonald's? You're going because if you're in an another country, they have an item that's specific to that that market, and you want to try it because you can't get it at home at McDonald's.

SPEAKER_01 7:48

I did that in Prague. We had a restaurant, we had a hotel we did in Prague, and it was the same thing going over there. So it's fun.

SPEAKER_00 7:53

But 40 years at Marriott International, um, we said before we got started, uh, you cracked a joke, which you're you also are funny, which I love, is you're like, there is life after Marriott, you know, and I think Marriott's one of the few gems out there where there are people that have been there for 35, 40 years. And I think it is scary for some of them. I I've I've met some people over the couple last couple of years that have left and they either have done really well, or some have you know, they still miss the good old days. But you know, you uh a matter of circumstances, you ended up being able to um to exit kind of on your timeline, potentially because of the pandemic. Everybody found themselves during the pandemic, and then you went, you immediately went out on your own. And now you're doing your own thing, you're working with consulting with other companies. And I mean, I love seeing what you post online just because it's I it seems like you're having fun right now, but you know, I'm sure you had fun in 40 years at Merriott as well.

SPEAKER_01 8:54

I've had I've been so lucky. You mentioned earlier graduating culinary industry in 1974, and I was a tech school kid and ended up going to college. And I will tell you this: this has been the greatest run of my life. It's just spectacular. I mean, meeting meeting people, working with hotels, being a partner, understanding the business model. I mean, it's it's just it's just do the right thing and it and it takes care of you, you know, giving back. I mean, all the cliche things you hear people say. You know, I'm doing right now, I'm involved with a local community college, and I was talking to my wife, and we're trying to get these kids in an internship program, blah, blah, blah, and it just didn't work out. The owner didn't want to pay for them. And my wife said to me, So why don't you start your own scholarship? So I said, that's a great idea. So I started my own scholarship, and it's a local community college, and I and I pay for a student's education because someone did it for me when I was in high school. So it's it's a give back, it's a give back community, and you know what I mean. You and I haven't spoken in five years. We picked it up like we didn't miss each other in five minutes, right? But this this community is that it's a give back and working together on things. And you know, if you if you if you cheat it, yeah, you'll catch you.

SPEAKER_00 10:16

Cheating never works out. Right? Cheating doesn't work out, and karma's a real thing. So yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:24

Oh, that the bang.

SPEAKER_00 10:26

No, but I also think it's um, you know, Tyler and I were talking about this on a drive from Palm Springs yesterday. It's uh a lot of people, there's a lot of us that sit on the front end of things, and we have had success in different areas, and you do different things, and you're successful, and you get a lot of rec recognition for the things that you do. But at the end of the day, like nothing happen nothing happens by a singular person. Like somebody might have had an idea or whatever, but it's the it's the team that's around you and it's the people you work with that make you successful.

SPEAKER_01 10:57

It's also that constant stream communication. You know, I will also say your your point is very solid. And the other thing is gener this you know, specific to a hotel, generally something just doesn't happen. There is a communication lapse that caused that somewhere. And what people shouldn't do is sit there and blame and try to find out whose fault it was, but really just go back and say, you know what, we said we're gonna have a BEO meeting or a Banco Devent Order meeting every day at two o'clock, and guess what? We chose not to do it that day. Yeah, you know, it's look at where the where where it happened, not not who it who did it, who cares, right? Tighten up, tighten up your communication, tighten up your your your your processes, and it's a great it's a great way to look at it.

SPEAKER_00 11:48

I think it's uh but to your point, I think uh it's it's more dramatic and it's more interesting for people to go blame somebody or find somebody to blame when something goes wrong.

SPEAKER_01 11:55

When in fact, like it's one finger out, three things I mean one finger out, three fingers pointing back.

SPEAKER_00 12:03

There is like you said, it's communication or the lack of at some point where like somebody dropped the ball, and it's like at the end of the day, the client or the customer doesn't really give a shit, right? Like they think it was you, like it was the hotel, it was right, you know, whatever the eight like company is. Like, I mean, it's true across the board, no matter what business you're in, really. And like more I'm more sensitive to it now, I think, just after having dealt with it for so long with employees, when I have a customer service experience, like at any other, like at a well, we won't use like the DMV as an example because they're y'all they're usually all kind of crazy, but uh, you know, you go and a customer service person is trying to like give you a whole rundown of why it wasn't their fault. It's like, I'm not accusing you of personally like sabotaging me, and nor do I really care in most cases, but it's like but they it's like human nature, they just gotta blame somebody to make themselves feel better. You know, hotels, and I think hotels are interesting just because they are such a in the industry as a whole, is it interesting because it's very tight-knit. I think there's really not a lot of us out there at the end of the day that have done it as a career, and but it's a place where so many people are able to launch very successful careers. And um, it's oh my goodness.

SPEAKER_01 13:17

Oh, absolutely. I I you know there's some really good guys. There's a there's a couple guys that that candidly I hired them as interns in Baltimore, yeah, that are very successful with franchise management companies right now. Just you know, just giving opportunities and working through things, but you have to you have to have confidence yourself to let people learn and not be afraid. Not be yeah, there's a lot of people.

SPEAKER_00 13:41

And it's like that's what I love about this industry is it's the it's one of the few that are still left that you really can just if you're willing to put the time and the work into because of people like you and I and other people in our circles, they'll help you and they'll give you the opportunities and you can really you can make a life for yourself and have a good life. It's not a dead-end job.

SPEAKER_01 14:04

And and and I think one of the neat things about it is there's not a there's not no one keeps score. You know what I mean? It's you know, I think that's one of the neatest things about it. I mean, I had a my cousins uh had to go into a hospital and uh my my she called me, blah blah blah. I ended up reaching out to a buddy of mine, he took care of the rooms for them while they're in the hospital. But it's not like I owe that person, you know what I mean? Our industry is that way. You just you know it's a it's hospitality, for goodness sake.

SPEAKER_00 14:36

Yeah, and we I feel like in some cases, some brands have gotten away from understanding it's hospitality, but I feel like we're far enough away from like the t tumultuous period of COVID that I'm starting to see some light at the end of the tunnel where people are bringing the hospitality back in. And um with technology too, like with AI stuff, we've just at a conference earlier this year, and they the big conversation was not about how we're gonna replace people, but how we need to we have this big database of all this information on these guests. How can we use AI to make these experiences better for these guests? And you know.

SPEAKER_01 15:12

Well, you know what? That's so true what you just said. I mentioned to you earlier when we were chatting that I'm kind of in the throes right now of doing three different concepts in three of the different hotels, and you you know, AI helped me get my do my job easier, it didn't replace me. I I I needed to know the questions, I needed to understand. I knew what is the concept. You know, you you and I spoke about this all the time. What is the concept? If you don't have a concept, you're in trouble, right? And that's what you do. You say, All right, here's my concept. Uh and one of them we're doing, you know, I'm in Maryland right now, we're doing a Maryland Eastern Shore grill room. So, you know, I need to know what what are the pieces we need to do. Let's make sure. Let's do our checklist, let's put this thing together. Right. I didn't feel threatened at all. I was like, holy cow, look how easy this makes. You know, it's it's it's that. But you I still have to know what questions I'm asking. 100%. And it's I still need to know where I can.

SPEAKER_00 16:09

Anything it's good for brainstorming, and sometimes it uh is you read it what it's telling you, and you're like, yeah, that's not never gonna happen. And then there's other times you're like, oh, I didn't actually even think about that. But if you again, you still have to be smart enough to know how to take the idea or move it, but it's uh it's a computer, it's only as smart as what people have taught it.

SPEAKER_01 16:30

You know, we did one of the one of the hotels we're doing it, we said, we need to figure out the competitive pricing on our menu. We just you know make sure we're there and take us about nine minutes. Right? Bang, here's the restaurant. Boom, here's your pricing, here's the items, and and we had it. And we just yeah, we just want to make sure that you know we're fairly priced, right?

SPEAKER_00 16:49

It's uh especially for like the not to a quick check or getting a pulse check on what you're doing. It's great. Like, and then you can then go by if you need to do a big serious thing, then go do a big serious study later. But it kind of gives you an idea do I even need to go down the road of the serious study? But uh, well, let's get into I got a couple. I don't want to say merit-specific questions, but again, you were there for four decades, sir. Um, so you spent a lot of time there. Um, there was a big which I feel so wonderful about because it is my favorite beverage, um, hit the hit the newswire in the last two weeks that uh Merritt International, after I think it was like 38 years that they've had the contract, they have decided to terminate their agreement with PepsiCo and are going to be serving Coca-Cola products at all 5,000 plus hotels globally. Um, I remember during the Starwood merger, because I came over from having hotels in the Starwood portfolio, uh, that was the biggest thing we were upset about was the fact that we had to, I mean, we had to switch to Pepsi and it was, and I remember the guests like revolting too and being upset about it. But I don't think we ever lost business before because of it, but people would always kind of complain. But Marriott Guest knew that they just it was always going to be Pepsi. Did you ever think you were going to see Pepsi go away?

SPEAKER_01 18:14

No, I think that I think that one of the things that the brands do, and and I think that sometimes from an operations point of view, you kind of feel that you're stifled, or you're not stifled, that you're you're you're treading way to get going. But I will say I think you know Hilton does a great job with it. I think I see these guys, I think these brand guys really do a great job of asking the customer what they want, getting the information that they're really like your comment about some of the some of the blowback from Starwood when he came over. And I think that they really did take a look at luxury tier and how that, you know, in when you've got in in any full service brand, or excuse me, any of the any of the brands, you you've got you know, you got a portfolio. So, you know, where where does it go across everywhere? And and is it a big miss in a in a in a brand or in in a you know in a segment that we need to address? And I, you know, it's not just for coke. I mean, we we do it for everything. And I think that this understanding what the guest is looking for is no different than what we talked about earlier when you go to a hotel and you expect to have crab cakes and marylons, right? When you you do your homework and you figure out what the great brand is looking for, and then you take a look and say, you know, what can they do to help us? And I think one of the comments, too, is it's not a knock on PepsiCo by any means. It's it's how do we move forward in training and how do we bring more value in in those regards? Because, you know, uh Zoom training and doing these things, it's it's real. And we need to we need to keep working at. And the other area, too, that I think they come into play is uh a little bit with um retail too. Retail is a huge space right now, as you as you know. I mean, it's just uh building that out. So I think that, you know, I think it was a very tough decision. You know, I know it was a tough decision in the building. I mean, I and I know that um, you know, uh Tony Capuano actually called the Pepsi folks and as the president and said it's a tough decision, but here's where we're going. Yeah and you know, so you know, it's it's where it is. I mean, it's based, you know, I think I think the most important thing is if it's data driven, then it's easier to easier to swallow, I guess, for lack of a better term, right?

unknown 20:28

It's a lot of people.

SPEAKER_00 20:28

Yeah, and they're I mean Marriott's standing by the fact that they're saying, hey, guess guest preference data that they've been collecting and that they and we know that they have a very large tranche of um is indicating that you know the preferences the guest wants wants coke products.

SPEAKER_01 20:46

But um, you know, I think it well that well I don't know if if if I'll get myself in trouble for saying this, but one of the questions we used to say all the time was you know, we asked the customers and they said they prefer this, and I had always had the caveat from going from an owner's perspective, where my owner's hat. I said, But then we asked them, would you pay seven dollars more for it? Right? Yeah, you want to give me it? Sure. Ten more dollars? Maybe not. And that's the Pepsi's coke. But you know, sometimes the data we get, sometimes the data we get is it but like you put some dollars to it, it's like, well, maybe my preference will change.

SPEAKER_00 21:26

Um, but I did find it.

SPEAKER_01 21:29

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 21:30

Yeah, did you pay 20 more hours for that?

SPEAKER_01 21:33

No, okay.

SPEAKER_00 21:33

It was interesting how something like, and I think it's true like with brands like McDonald's, too, that you know, have served Coca-Cola their entire existence. And you know, everybody knows like a Coke, like a regular Coke and like a diet coke at McDonald's just tastes a specific way and they know it that tastes. It was interesting to me that it was global news, though. And it was like on in on all the major news networks, it was announced that Merriott was, you know, switching over to. Because I had been through some changes in the past with other brands, and it was never like there was never a press release. There was never, no one was doing interviews about it. And I like it's interesting to me to look at it from the perspective of it's so ingrained in the brand that you have to it has to be addressed. When at the end of the day, it's like people switch from Coke to Pepsi or Pepsi to Coke on a like it happens every year. People forget, I think it's not just about the Coke, Diet Coke, Sprite, you know, Sierra Mist, Pepsi, Diet Pepsi. It's these companies, PepsiCo, Coca-Cola, they've got huge lists of products that they manufacture that they've developed that are not just those core beverages. So it's, you know, it's really it could end up at the end of the day not even be a matter of actually coke. It could be a completely different product that we don't even know about.

SPEAKER_01 22:56

Yeah, I mean, in Pepsi, in PepsiCo's, you know, they got the Quaker line, the Gatorade line. I mean, they got those that product line. And it is, I mean, retail is huge. And not just in that area, I mean, you're the the alcohol piece. We're, you know, in our hotels, we're adding alcohol into all of our retail space. You know, the you know, one of the small bottles or the you know, the uh canned cocktails, stuff like that, which are it's amazing how those can canned cocktails will sell.

SPEAKER_00 23:26

And people buy it, people pay it for them too. Like they won't spend their penny.

SPEAKER_01 23:31

Yeah, yeah, I think you have to, you know, I think one of the things, you know, you you talk to some folks about this all the time, and in the retail space, you just have to be real. You can't you got you can't gouge. You just can't gouge. That's the thing, right? You get a fair price and understanding me travel on the road.

SPEAKER_00 23:49

I realize it's convenience, but I think people don't in their minds, they're like, well, it's in the hotel, so I can charge more for it. But the reality is, it's and that may have been true, I think, at some point in time when you could do that because people didn't have options. But now that you do have DoorDash and Uber Eats, which is interesting because, you know, one of the things that I wanted to make sure I talked to you about today was I had an experience at a hotel this week that just I had several experiences at this hotel guy. Um, I had stayed at this hotel nine or 10 years ago when it was part of the tribute portfolio with Starwood. And I was there for training. And I will never forget that there was no hot water most of the days. I know this, I remember this because this time I'm back, you know, almost a decade later, is now with another franchise system. There was no freaking hot water again. Like you, and they're getting ready to do another multi-million dollar renovation. I'm like, I was joking with Tyler, so I kind of want to call them and tell them, can you fix the hot water during this next renovation? Crazy.

SPEAKER_01 24:55

I well, I tell you, I'll tell you a quick story about that, and I won't mention who, where, when, or where. But I always had a hotel and uh we're doing the renovation, and and again, you know, the team wanted to do the the painting and the lipstick and making it really look good. And the the meeting planner said, but your roof's leaking in the atrium. Right? And the guy said, Well, you know, he goes, Well, you can't brag about that. He goes, Well, you're leaking, you should have hot water, you should have a roof that doesn't leak. I mean, there's no sizzle to that. It's something it doesn't speak to anybody, but that's um, it's so funny.

SPEAKER_00 25:32

People do that all the time, too. It's like, um, they expect people just expect a roof that's not gonna leak. Like that's like when you're buying a hotel, especially, that always comes up. But this place, I mean it's a big property, it's a well-known property. We're not gonna put them on blast because I really do love the people there. But uh I had I call down to order in-room dining because still, I mean, I I think I'm in the generation where like in-room dining's not supposed to be specifically targeted, like for me. But like that's to me, if there's no in-room dining available, it's almost like camping. It's just a thing. I think it's like I need it. I call down, the man's very nice. His name was Brian, too. So he was very excited when he checked me in. But I called the restaurant number to order it. They it rings and rings, it rolls to the front desk. And he's at first like, well, I don't know. Let me find out. Well, okay, well, it says here, I'm supposed to call this extension to place my in-room dining order. And he comes back on the line and says, you know, unfortunately, uh, we don't have in-room dining today. You'll have to go to come down to the restaurant because they won't answer the phone either because you know, they're short staffed or whatever. And um, you'll have to place a the order with the poststander at the bar, and then they'll give it to you to go to go. Well, the reality was I had to think about, and this is property, you know, and it's in Palm Springs, so it's like it's very spread out, it's a resort. And uh I'm at a building that's towards the back. Well, here's the thing. I had to make a decision. I was like, well, it's actually closer to walk to my car and drive, just go someplace than it is for me to walk to the lobby. So I ended up just getting in the car. And this is a crazy thing. I didn't even go anywhere fancy. I ended up at a Dell Taco. I ended up at a freaking Dell Taco because I was like, oh, that sounds good. But I it was like, why are we offering something that we can't execute on? And like and I think that to me it was a missed opportunity because then I'm thinking, well, how many guests did what I did, or they just ordered something on DoorDash or Uber Eats or something? And uh, you know, and I guess the reason I'm asked bringing this up is you know, the advent of DoorDash and all these apps and everything that came out. Like, how have you seen that affect the hotels over the last couple of years?

SPEAKER_01 27:53

And well, I think I think your story capsulates capsulates it's it's the reality. I mean, we're we you know, I had an old boss years and years ago, he's from Italy, and he told me, he goes, Guy, he said the Americans are the most polite customers in the world. In Italy, if there's not a good experience, they scream and they yell and they just go crazy about it. He goes, but you Americans are very nice, you're very polite, you just get up, you walk away, and you never come back. And and you know, and it is. I mean, we, you know, and a couple other things, Brian, you know it too. I mean, you've seen it, you, you've, you, you, you talk against it and fight for it. But even the pricing on room service, when we start, you know, when you when it's gonna cost you$135 for a bottle of champagne or just some of the ridiculousness of it, and it's just like, it's supposed to, I get it. I get it's enough charge because you're bringing up my room, and I understand that there's that piece of it. But my goodness, you just can't keep just taking advantage of it. And I think that's what a lot of people have done. They what you said is exactly that. I'm gonna pay overpriced for a burger, and like you said, like, oh, I want it a simple burger, you know, a Caesar salad. You know it as well as I do. The burger, Caesar salad, grill sound, and the steak are like the number, you know, see chicken seizure. Yeah, and I actually love hotels where that's the better one.

SPEAKER_00 29:14

I'm like, you know what, this hotel just gets it. They're not even gonna offer anything uh else.

SPEAKER_01 29:21

You're not gonna put a$73 rack of lamb with you know.

SPEAKER_00 29:24

The only hotel that doesn't, that's slightly different, I think, and I'll give a shout out. I think it's Columbia Sussex that manages the hotel is the Hilton O'Hare. I will tell you, it's the funniest thing. I love a good chicken. I am a chicken whore. Like I love chicken. The roasted chicken at the Hilton O'Hare that's on the room service menu. Fantastic. Okay. I'll let Henry know.

SPEAKER_01 29:48

Henry Michad is the GP of food and beverage team. He's a great friend, really good guy. And but you know what? They do a very good job. They they create a core menu, they let the hotels be creative in their market, but the core is that, and then core plus, right? So that's so you know, that helps without right, without strangling creating.

SPEAKER_00 30:10

That's the big thing. Is you can't let and you had said this to me a long time ago when we were working on that uh project in Phoenix. It's you know, use the talent you got here. Like the people that are here know how to make these things, and you know, better than anybody that can write a like you can write a recipe from the corporate office on the east coast, but you know, especially like salsa and like you know, things like Southwest food, the people in the Southwest know how to make it better. And um, you know, I it's funny, it makes me think of a story. I was at a hotel last April in Mexico, beautiful resort um down in Tulum. And I was talking to the general manager, and he had been transferred down there from another uh resort in the States, and he was so frustrated because I was like, the food just wasn't what I was expecting. And I was talking to him and I said, I've loved everything. The only thing that's kind of odd, and I didn't even get it out of my mouth, guy. He just said, he goes, Let me guess the food at the pool and the food at the bar. And I was like, I said, yeah, I said, I don't get it. I said, the tacos, like everything is just so like bland. And they had other restaurants on site and the food there was good, but they had like worked with the local company to like contract those concepts. And he goes, Yeah, he goes, I'm having a fight right now with my supervisor back in the states because they keep demanding that like our salsa has to be made with this like specific recipe that they've given us, you know, that was written off out of an office in the states and something else. And he's like, I keep trying to tell them it's like I'm he goes, I don't know how to say it the politically correct way to be like the Mexican guy that is Mexican, that lives in Mexico, knows how to make salsa.

SPEAKER_01 31:58

Well, you know, I I'll give you an example of something like that that you take advantage or you don't take advantage of. We opened, geez, the stofers in Baltimore 40 38 years, 35 years ago. And we walk in, and I was a chef, and I was a young guy, and I have all the answers, and the general manager's there, and he came up from Florida, and the FB director came in from Chicago, and general manager looked at us and he said, Listen, we're in Baltimore. I want you to find out who in that kitchen right now makes the best crab cake, and that's the crab cake. Because you're not from Baltimore, I'm not from Baltimore. We have to have the best crab cake in Baltimore. And we went back and we looked at it and found some guys that could make them pretty good, and we never varied from it. And I made them for Bill Marriott. Bill Marriott goes, Guy, this is the best crab cake you've ever had. And I'm like, There you go, it's a married crab cake, Mr. Marriott. But to your point, it's a in your market, they know this level.

SPEAKER_00 32:59

Well, that's the thing. I think if you involve them in it too, like it just makes them so much more proud of what they're making. And and I find it internationally, the FMB teams like are I would almost say they take even more pride in it than I would say regionally we do here in the United States. Because I think this the states, like there's regional things people eat, but it's kind of the same across like we the majority of their food is the same. But I always find it fun when you go visit hotels in other countries and that they love to show off and like make things like are that aren't on the menu for you. Like and um somebody told I can't remember who told me this. Maybe it was you, maybe it was somebody else. At some point, they had said when I started traveling where internationally, like, just ask the restaurant server, like what if the chef can just make something for you. And I thought I didn't, and I'm in here in the States, like I just knew not to do to ever do something like that because it feels like you're being like treating the menu as like a list of ingredients. But I learned like they actually like when you go to other countries, especially and like um especially like um boutique hotels and stuff, those chefs would they love making like a regional thing for you, like and they can whip it up like in minutes. And it's like they have such pride in it. So, like if you're you know, it works here too, like your point, you know, you're in Baltimore, you gotta like if you're gonna be if you're gonna do the crab cake, you gotta do the crab cake well. You can't do it, you can't do it so so. It's like absolutely like if you're gonna put queso on your menu in Texas, it's gotta be the best, you know, damn good queso out there. But uh, you know, you really had a realistic view when you were at uh when you were at Marriott about how food and beverage had to be executed. And you understood that there were standards that had to be in place, and you understood that everybody had their place from the design and construction teams and the brand teams and everyone. But you know, one thing I took away from you was that you really believed that at the end of the day that you understood that it was an owner's asset or an investor that was putting money into to a property, and you understood the customer and that they just wanted to eat good food that was what they were expecting when they got there. You know, for 40 years with Marriott, I think a lot of people would expect that you would be like, you know, almost just a walking regurgitation of Marriott. And, you know, you're you're not that guy. You're not that guy guy. And uh I was just curious, like, where did that how did that develop during your time at Marriott? Because it obviously I think is one of the reasons you were very successful and you're continuing to be successful.

SPEAKER_01 35:33

It was it was a challenge. I mean, and I would I would say we're we as a company are very good at spending someone else's money. And I said, we owe it to that owner, that partner. If we want to do more deals, let's be realistic to them. If if it's if it makes sense, but you know, if a guy's only doing like it with you know, a million dollars, and when I say only, it's still successful. I'm not knocking anybody, but you do a million dollars of revenue in a restaurant, and the you know, the pip comes in or the proper property improvement plan comes in, it's two and a half million dollars. I'm like, how would this person ever pencil this thing? Or, you know, we we get in a situation where you know the someone from the brand or the design team would come in and say, Oh, let's move the bar over there. I'm like, do you realize the impact of moving a bar is probably three quarters of a million dollars, if you know, all in moving back and forth and stuff? I said, what what does it really do for that owner? And are you gonna be willing to stand there at the end and say, see how he's right doing this? And and you have to. You just have to, it's not, I just really, really always believe that it's not my money. How do I make sure that if it was my money, what would I do with it? And I and I, you know, if anyone from the brand would say that's well, explain to me why that's wrong to act that way towards a customer, right? Yeah, if it was my money, would I spend that? No. Now, if I had the ability and the upside, absolutely, but not just as just as a you know rote thing. And we used to, I mean, we we ended up getting you know variations for the great room. You remember some of the channels, you know, there's some of those rooms, and you know, this size hotel could do this, and and you see it, and I will say it was fun. Now, I don't know if my boss always was happy with me being always fighting with the guys, but it was fun. It was fun bringing the perspective from an owner's point of view.

SPEAKER_00 37:47

There have to, if everybody in the room always agrees, you've already lost the game. Like you're you're not gonna be successful.

SPEAKER_01 37:55

Like it's uh Yeah, I sat down with one owner and uh he said, I want to sit next to you. I've I've I've heard some things about you, and I'm like, uh oh. And I and I and I had dinner and he's kind of drilling me the whole night. And he goes, Yeah, you're one of those.

SPEAKER_00 38:11

Well, and that's how I felt the first time I met actually met you and spoke to you. Even the first time I talked to you on the phone when you I had asked you to come out to visit me, and we had a conversation. I remember getting off the phone and I was like, shit, this is like the real first person from the brand side I've spoken to. Like, he gets it, like he understands what the challenge is. And uh and I appreciated that so much as an operator because you knew you knew what I was like what I was dealing with and what I was facing, and you're like, and you're like, look, this is what they're going to tell you, but and it it works here and here, but this is why it doesn't work here, and uh but uh it's it's true though, you like if you're not because again, we've all been in these restaurants in these hotels where they'll be beautiful, but they make no money, and it's like, why did you spend all this money? But I think it also goes if you don't have a concept either. I think that's where the design a lot of times ends up running way crazy because then they just don't even have anything to work off of.

SPEAKER_01 39:15

That's you know, that that is to me anything that I would for for a couple reasons. Number one, concept, what are you? And you and please don't say farm the table. Please, I mean, everyone can you know, it's like we get it. We we all get fresh food, okay? So let's but you know, I mean, you know, we got a uh I'm doing a hotel right now in in the mid-Hudson Valley, and it is it is absolutely mid-Hudson Valley focused. I mean, we're talking about mushrooms and different, but you want it to be that way, but you have to be able to describe it. I I would challenge, and I, you know, you I uh we would kid about this. I would say, what is your elevator speech? What are you telling a guest in the elevator what's your restaurant, right? And it's always, oh, it's nice. We've got hamburger, we've got the, you know, and then you're like, you can almost think the menu in the top of your head, right? You know what they're gonna be ordering, you can order it from your room. But you know, if you come into Baltimore and say, You we have the fresh seafood. As a matter of fact, the chef's got soft shell crabs that he just got from the from the airport today that we're selling. That's a hundred percent that to me is selling, right? You've you've got to market. You know, we used to do silly things like we had uh in Baltimore, we had a rooftop, uh the pool was on an indoor pool on the roof, and I said, let's go upstairs and we put a garden. We had tomatoes, we had vegetables, herbs, we had all kinds of stuff around there, and we would go water the garden at noontime. If you're a gardener, you know it's the worst time to water anything. But you know why it was the best time? Because there was people at the pool. So all of a sudden, a lady comes out, what are you doing? A guest come, what are you doing, this and that. And I said, Oh, this is our basil. And then I would go downstairs and we'd have me jars of basil, uh, pesto made up, and I send a note up and I send it to a room and say, It's nice talking to you at the pool. Here's some pesto. Come on down and buy an appetizer if you'd like to, but here's a guess, here's some from the hotel. Right experiences are what you would remember, right? It's it's that. I mean, we used to put a uh, you know, uh the recipe for our crab cake and our soup, our chowder on a on a on a bookmark. So it's just you know, four by twelve, right? And the Bellman back in the day when everyone had Bellman, one would keep in his pocket. And we'd just say, hey, you can't go home without one of these. And you know what? You come back and it's it's a memory, but how much it's it's it's you're giving them an experience.

SPEAKER_00 41:46

It's making them feel something, right? As opposed to just, you know, thanks.

SPEAKER_01 41:51

Over well, you know, even thinking about we used to, you know, we're we're big on keeping the kids happy because if the kids are happy, mom and dad will eat in the hotel. So we did a deal where we had we put a frisbee, a pizza on a frisbee, we did a steak with a cowboy hat, we did a Baltimore Oreo of Battingham with a hot dog, we did uh uh a sailor cap for fish and chips. And guess what? The kids would want to eat, so guess where the parents are gonna eat, right? So don't sell kids short because it's so funny you say that.

SPEAKER_00 42:27

I remember so my career started at a holiday in. And so Holiday Inn has the kids eat free program. Yep, it used to be more expansive than they have it than it is these days, but they used to have a lot more advertising about it, and like we had like big color, like all sorts of coloring books, and there were like activities and stuff. I didn't realize until I had left the Holiday Inn and went to a another brand that how big of a difference that makes in the environment, like in the restaurant and everything. Because again, because the kids were happy, and then on top of it, the parents were happy too, because they weren't paying for the kids, but because it was kid focused, it like made everybody, you know, calm. Um, I've worked with some awesome FB people in the past, and you know, I'm preparing to talk to you today. I was thinking about a lot of them. And the ones that I thought that I know were most successful that I worked with before I was like at the corporate office, that when I was on property, were the ones that would actually like bring the front. Well, they they would like I was director of front office, front office manager. Like they would bring my team something at the end of the day and be like, hey, this is this is what we're pushing in the restaurant tonight. And so they would have everybody try it. Um, even like the phone operators would try it because then it made it easier for us to m to drive traffic to the restaurant in the hotel if we had actually eaten it. Um and it just made it kind of built the team more, so it wasn't us against them and all of that.

SPEAKER_01 43:54

But uh it was No, you're it's I mean, the the the the front there. agents is the beating they take anyway. I mean anything else you can you know God bless them right I mean you know the drill but anything you can do to sort of build a camaraderie between the between the teams and stuff like that and just understand it again it's hospitality right you you you take take care right you know as boomer has you take care of the guests what it is like it's that's why we're in the hospitality business is we're taking care of people and uh yeah I think it's funny and then on top of it I learned over the years that like the bartenders that was kind of their the the trade was like I could tell the bartender about a guest that's having an issue because I knew that I knew the guest was going to hit the bar and then the bartender could help us on a guest recovery standpoint like make their experience even better.

SPEAKER_00 44:44

But likewise the bartenders would always keep us in the loop if they hear because you know the guests are talking and a lot of times it's funny how the guests will tell the bartenders about issues that are going on that they won't tell us about, but then we're able to then fix and take care of and then yeah and I'll never forget I had an employee that was like well I'm upset because this you know I fixed this issue for this person or for this guest and uh you know he like wrote a big review but he only congratulated he was hell happy about the bartender because she got all the credit for doing it and she didn't do anything. She just told me I said well but you got to look at it from his perspective. He doesn't know you did it but he told her and she in his mind she obviously took ownership of it but then the the technical part of this is then she went and had like talk to you about it because she couldn't fix the problem. She the front office had to fix the issue. And uh I'm like you can't look at it that way. It's not like it's not an us against them thing. We're a team here like we have to work together.

SPEAKER_01 45:50

And uh it's uh like especially I mean word to everyone your restaurant servers and your bartenders are potentially your your hidden gems when it comes to your guest recovery and finding out finding out if there's hidden things that are going on that you don't know about they are true ambassadors they really are I mean they're they're a conduit between the guest experience don't you know reality you can't treat them like they're just another amenity.

SPEAKER_00 46:17

It's like like you know pump them up. But uh well we're almost out of time but I do have a couple like more crazier questions for you because I thought about like I like I said we were Tyler and I spent some time in the car as we do and uh we were talking about all sorts of things before today and I thought you know I'm that guy has some good stories because I definitely I've had my own fair share of experiences but um what hot what hotel well I don't need to name names but you can describe it. Where have you had the worst hotel breakfast? Now I think hotel breakfast to me has to be one of the easiest things to execute but it can be done very well but it can go off the rails. What has what's your worst hotel breakfast?

SPEAKER_01 47:06

I had it it was probably yesterday candidly because it was just it was a a buffet with just crappy bacon crappy sauces scrambled eggs and just just that don't do it don't do it if you're you know and you just you get there and you're like you kidding me and you're like and then oh and it's it was a brand and oh but don't forget that's included I'd rather not be included then you know and it was just it was just such and I think that I just think the people you know one of the things we're really trying to do in our properties is really figure out and that's just specific to breakfast I think hotels be wise do this is some sort of a delighter. It's not a big deal like I'll give you an example like you know how many times have you seen you're speaking of breakfast you know two eggs over easy and this is a little bit old time with a piece of kale and a half of an orange twist and that's the garnish that's on your egg plate, right? I'm like, who eats it? But how about if you took a little cobbler made a little warm apple cobbler and you put that on the side of the plate with a little struce on it a little bit of powder sugar on it. It's nice and warm and you drop that down on the plate or by the way you sit down and have a cup of coffee for breakfast and by the way the chef has here's a little something for you to try. It's it's it's nothing it's nothing but you know you you you mentioned breakfast and I don't want to really go into the story too much with it too but there's a perfect we used to have a lot of success with I say a lot a a good amount of success we want to guess who's charging your breakfast to a room to the room we would say Mr Smith uh do you have dinner reservations planned for tonight yet you want us to make you one and we would get because you're not some guys oh I have a dinner I have to go to some yeah yeah why don't I you know you know I mean but I think what breakfast breakfast isn't just slopping the eggs down it's really an opportunity to showcase your hotel yeah but I definitely to your point I've seen some bad ones it's like if you gotta do if you're gonna do it do it right and uh and you don't need to have 40 pounds I'd say Bill Mary would just go crazy if he went back and she like 40 pounds of eggs in a pan and bacon stacked up and I'll never forget one time and I will tell you you know you talk about experience you get that guy he he what a what a what a pro he was right and I'll never forget I was with him one time and there's a bacon you know the infamous bacon with nine pounds of bacon in the in the shaping dish and Mr. Marriott goes what's that bacon why is it all there and the chef thought he was clever and he goes well I'm gonna use it for the club sandwiches and other things and the burger and this and that Mr.

SPEAKER_00 50:06

Marriott said then just cook it fresh for the burgers and the and that like why make right which is funny like because we've all seen it right you've all like everybody's gone in and like you've seen it they've literally cooked all the food for the entire day is in the shafing dishes and um yeah yeah I never I never understood that like why people thought that was the way to go because it was like and then on top of it to that point like yeah cook it fresh because at the end of the day like you can always tell when the bacon actually has been sitting for a long like it's it's it's aged a little bit. And then I'm gonna leave you with you might not find this to be funny. I feel like this is funny. So we're gonna talk about it. Because we need a food and beverage expert to answer this question for us here. So we started speaking about health inspections this week. And I has was telling I made a comment I was like you know when I lived in Chicago some of the breast best breakfast actually that I've had would be at like the diner or something I would find and the letter grade in the window would be like a C. Maybe lower sometimes so we got talking and you know a lot of us like you know even my producer has been Tyler he's been he's worked food service he he gets it from the fat angle and it's like you know we people freak out when the health inspector's coming but then I got to think about I'm like it's funny like you can eat there's really good food sometimes at the places that just have like really bad food scores. And then we started talking I have another colleague of mine that um we're he's we're good friends now we've we're we've known each other I think for like 20 years now. But uh we both worked at a hotel in Chicago together that uh um actually I'll just say the hotel it was the Crown Plaza Chicago Metro and uh they have a restaurant they had a restaurant there called Dine. I don't even know if it's still there anymore or if they've changed the the concept but we had a thing at this hotel that we called the Dine Effect guy. Now our health inspections you got it we got an A plus the place is very and the place was very clean. But as an employee you didn't eat the food because at least 10 minutes after you ate it you were probably going to be like running through the the hotel to the nearest restroom. But we also and this is horrible of me as a front office person but we would also watch guests experience this dine effect where like every at least once a day you would see somebody come flying out of that restaurant door and it's like I've been there man like I know. And so it got us talking about like yeah like the health inspections and the grades and stuff.

SPEAKER_01 52:44

So I guess it's a two part question or it's kind of one question or two questions in one like why is it that some of the best places end up doing the worst with the health department and then some of the places that do the best with the health department if you eat the food you're gonna get the best colon cleansing of your life I was focusing because I think I think the guys with the best food in the dirtier place are worried about how good the food tastes and I think that the other guys are sitting there saying what's the board of health saying and not even paying attention to the kitchen. And I would tell you probably most of the hotel restaurants are not one and you know we I you know that I used to teach tease your guys our guys I go back in a kitchen and say hey where's the salt and pepper? Just a simple statement on the line and if the cook had to go climb up and get it I go well then you're not seasoning or not tasting anything but you got the cleanest kitchen in the world with the crappiest food. But I and I think I think it's now trust me I'm certainly oh yeah you know we have a lot of liability a lot of things like that so I'm certainly not not not downgrading the importance of it but I do think I think that more people that they if they just they they they they can't cook. You know you we've talked about this I I tell kids or students or anybody you know when they're interviewing uh if I call another chef up it's a three for pardon my HR people it's a three word question yeah can they cook period can they cook I I don't want to know I don't care if they can do you know spreadsheets I I'm I'm hiring a cook I can they like not the basics this is the job can they cook yeah which is a fair question I think that's a fair question right like you know you can be really smart on the computer but if you can't cook this is not the job for you can they cook do they do they taste and just you know understanding you know leaving stuff out keeping stuff refrigerated and they're I like that though can yeah that's the one place you expect like you need to make sure you can cook just in my opinion but now guy people have the chance to work with you now like if they are having issues in their hotel food and beverage operations or they're building a hotel and they need to figure out what to do with their their restaurant and what they're gonna do with their F activations you're available like you're available how do how do people connect with you absolutely and get to work with you it's guy knows F B L C and I'll shoot you my uh my wife and I when I went to the bank the the guy said to me he goes what's your company's name I say guy knows F and B and my wife goes I don't like that name I said well it's your business my business but it is and I it's it's pretty simple and I can get you that information if there's anybody needs to know but it's reach out I'm happy to do anything I look I I have a buddy a guy a friend of mine is a banker and his said he goes one of my customers is having trouble and this and that and he goes can you talk to him sure we I mean you know if if if it I thought it'd be free for everybody but no call me I have a question hey I have a question yeah you never know and then maybe it's not this one that you get to work on but some free advice sometimes ends up being another a bigger job down the road so you never know but uh awesome this was great I'm glad we got to sit down I could talk to you all day um but unfortunately we have to get we both have to get back to our day jobs but uh uh this was absolutely you're fun it uh listen I I enjoyed when we worked together back up properties and I have nothing but respect for what you're doing and how you do things you're you're you're a pro. Yeah at the end of the day it's you get it you understand this business.

SPEAKER_00 56:44

It's it's doing the right thing at the end of the day and just you know not overcomplicating it. Well thank you again guy for joining me this was amazing. Like I said I've been trying to get you on the podcast for a while and I'm glad that we were able to sit down today but we both have to get back to our day jobs. And uh I know that our paths will cross again soon and everyone be sure to reach out to Guy if you need any assistance food and beverage wise. If you're an operator owner he's open to uh to work with anybody even if you're a quick serve restaurant company he's the man for you. So be sure to uh look him up online and we'll also connect you as well and we'll see you next week for another episode of Check in with Brian Check in with Brian is a production of RH Media Productions executive produced by Tyler Alexander. The views and opinions expressed in this episode are those of the host and guests and do not necessarily reflect the positions of Reliance Hospitality Global Limited Co. its affiliates or subsidiaries all content is provided for informational and entertainment purposes only and should not be construed as professional legal, financial or investment advice. Always consult a qualified professional before making decisions regarding your business